Logs for #nikola for 2015-09-23

12:49:25 <KwBot> [nikola] ralsina assigned issue #2112 to ralsina: Role :doc: is not aware of locale https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2112
15:13:10 <KwBot> [nikola] ralsina opened issue #2113: Should nikola auto rebuild when plugins or nikola itself changes? https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2113
17:24:21 <KwBot> [nikola] ralsina closed issue #2109: Possible bug in `get_asset_path`? https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2109
17:24:37 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- [nikola] ralsina deleted fix-get-asset-path at d895162: http://git.io/vnicF
17:28:54 -travis-ci:#nikola- getnikola/nikola#6469 (master - 9d5093c : Roberto Alsina): The build passed.
17:28:55 -travis-ci:#nikola- Change view: https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/compare/8840c710fb6e...9d5093cc836a
17:28:55 -travis-ci:#nikola- Build details: https://travis-ci.org/getnikola/nikola/builds/81816805
18:36:08 <ChrisWarrick> MIDWAY PYTHON 2/3 SURVEY REPORT: only 10 out of 135 people refuse to use Python 3.  A lot of people are unaware that Python 2 and 3 can work side-by-side (including 2 nay-sayers)
18:45:37 <ralsina_> ChrisWarrick: the fabric one and the aerospace python 2 guy?
18:46:30 <ChrisWarrick> ralsina_: there’s at least one more person at the end: “There are some packages or libraries not suported py3.”
18:46:41 <ralsina_> ChrisWarrick: right
18:50:30 <ChrisWarrick> > More important to me than the Python version is that Nikola runs on Arm architectures.
18:50:54 <ChrisWarrick> We had someone run it on raspberry pi, right?  (It was slow, but it would work, wouldn’t it?)
18:53:26 <ralsina_> why wouldn´t it? But yes, crazy slow
18:53:56 <ralsina_> we should write a "answers" section for the conclusions / review of the poll
18:55:03 <ChrisWarrick> as in, what people wrote and why they were wrong?
18:59:04 <ralsina_> or why they should not worry, to put it nicely
19:05:31 <teknico> are all tests supposed to pass on master? ========== 24 failed, 134 passed, 3 skipped, 4 error in 74.16 seconds ==========
19:10:41 <ralsina_> teknico: yes they are.Travis tells us they do :-)
19:11:30 <ralsina_> https://travis-ci.org/getnikola/nikola
19:14:51 <teknico> ralsina_, I'd like to write a patch to make section folders translatable, any reason I should not?
19:15:06 <ralsina_> no reason why not!
19:15:30 <ralsina_> teknico: you may want to discuss approach with Aeyoun if you are not 100% sure how to do it
19:15:42 <ralsina_> I have very little idea about sections at this point
19:16:44 <teknico> ralsina_, yeah, I was going to ask him
19:17:00 <Aeyoun> teknico: they are already.
19:17:31 <Aeyoun> Don't remember who, but it was fixed a week or two ago.
19:18:47 <Aeyoun> ChrisWarrick: I've run on raspberry pi a, b, b+, and 2
19:19:05 <Aeyoun> Fixed a bug or two for it at some point.
19:20:18 <teknico> Aeyoun, you sure? Post.folder still looks untranslated in Post.destination_path
19:22:04 <Aeyoun> teknico: yeah,  pretty sure.
19:22:53 <Aeyoun> Your English /food/ section would be /mat/ in Swedish and appear as /sv/mat/, for example.
19:24:04 <teknico> Aeyoun, how do I make it work? I need to set POSTS_SECTION_FROM_META = True and set the section in posts' metadata, right?
19:24:26 <teknico> because the source files for all languages are in the same folder, the English one
19:26:17 <Aeyoun> teknico: there are many approaches. 
19:27:31 <Aeyoun> POSTS set to ("posts/*.sv.md", "mat", "post.tmpl"), ("posts/*.en.md", "food", "post.tmpl"), would produce /food/ and /sv/mat/, for example.
19:28:19 <Aeyoun> teknico: or ("food/*.md", "food", "post.tmpl"), ("mat/*.md", "mat", "post.tmpl") would probably be easier to manage
19:29:13 <teknico> Aeyoun, aha! I suspected I had to add entries to POSTS for each section
19:29:18 <Aeyoun> or use post meta data if you prefer that to spreading source files by a naming scheme or folder. ("/posts/*.mat.md", "mat", ...) wouldalso work.
19:30:16 <Aeyoun> teknico: not really. POSTS = ("posts/*.md", "", "post.tmpl") and folders inside posts would output your posts to folders/sections matching those names while only creating one section
19:30:42 <teknico> Aeyoun, I'd prefer to use folders for sections and not having to add section entries to metadata
19:30:43 <Aeyoun> teknico: it really just depend on the output folder. however you want to manage your posts to output them to the right folder is up to you.
19:31:00 <Aeyoun> you can bypass folder management by using metadata, but then you don’t get cool sectionated URLs.
19:31:21 <teknico> I do like sections in URLs
19:31:30 <Aeyoun> then you have to change the output folder. ;)
19:31:54 <Aeyoun> POSTS = ("posts/*.md", "", "post.tmpl") let you keep all your posts in one folder. make subfolders for each section.
19:32:16 <Aeyoun> the subfolders are put in output/ root and thus becomes sections. Magic.
19:32:18 <teknico> but I'd also like to keep the link between translations of the same post
19:32:57 <Aeyoun> Yeah. That is something I didn’t think about.
19:34:17 <Aeyoun> Test if it works, would you? Make a bug if it doesn’t. Probably need a new metadata for that instead. like "translations: /mat/köttbullar.html" or something. Not sure what would be the best way to manage that.
19:34:40 <Aeyoun> Some of the actual bilingual blog maintainers in here would possibly have a solution for this ready.
19:34:55 <teknico> Aeyoun, well, I've been trying different approaches for quite a while now :-)
19:35:11 <Aeyoun> I do realize that it makes no sense for me as a Norwegian to use Swedish in my examples. There is no good reason for it. :P
19:35:25 <Aeyoun> Oh,  guess it’s a foreign-ish language I know other than English.
19:36:05 <Aeyoun> teknico: I think a manual meta-based mapping is probably the best option. because you can’t really keep track of it otherwise.
19:37:14 <ralsina_> well, we could correlate top-level folders as translated sections then match by filename to find translations of a post, but ...  it gets complicated :-P
19:37:37 <teknico> Aeyoun, nope, the filename should be translated too :-)
19:38:36 <Aeyoun> ralsina_: when the section name and the slug are different per language, you kind of just have to keep track of it manually:  /sv/mat/köttbullar.html, /en/food/ikea-meatballs.html
19:38:47 <ralsina_> yeah
19:39:00 <ralsina_> teknico: you don't need to translate the filename if you translate the slug
19:39:04 <ralsina_> or viceversa :-)
19:39:27 <ralsina_> but yes, correlating posts in different languages in different folders as being "the same" is going to be manual
19:39:30 <Aeyoun> But it becomes hard to keep track of things when the slug and file names don’t  match. o.O
19:40:06 <teknico> that's true
19:40:30 <Aeyoun> So make a bug about adding a "translations" metadata thing for adding links to translated variants of a post.
19:41:15 <Aeyoun> There will always be a added cost for sexy URLs.
19:42:10 <teknico> Aeyoun, do you mean pretty URLs, the ones that mutate resources into spurious collections? :-P
19:42:38 <teknico> (that is, files into folder/index.html)
19:43:49 <ralsina_> teknico: what do you mean spurious collections? That's just the easy way to do it without forcing people to configure their webservers
19:44:10 <ralsina_> the URL there is folder/  the  index.html is an implementation detail ;-)
19:44:21 <teknico> ralsina_, that's still what they are, whatever the final purpose
19:44:56 <teknico> it's a common misuse of folders, I also dislike that it's recommended practice with django, for example
19:45:07 <ralsina_> teknico: also, it allows you to do things like foo.txt foo/image.png and keep a non-spurious collection in one nice place.
19:45:11 <Aeyoun> Tried various things to figure out why the "copy_assets:output/assets/css/code.css" task is run so often, but I’m getting nowhere. Every part of the code seem to work fine. The task doesn’t in any way look outdated but is marked as such immediately upon task completion.
19:46:28 <Aeyoun> I don’t use "pretty URLs" and leave in the .html because then there is room for error-correction when people mess up copied URLs. I redirect .htm to .html and so on. ^___^ Plus, I like HTML. Don’t mind letting it show.
19:46:48 * Aeyoun marches back and forth in a sporadic HTML Pride parade
19:46:52 <ralsina_> hahaha
19:47:00 <ralsina_> Aeyoun: NOONE LIKES HTML DUDE
19:47:06 <ralsina_> except you
19:47:13 <teknico> ralsina_, ok, if you have a group of related resources in one places, then it starts to make sense
19:47:33 <teknico> but mutating each html file into a folder repulses me :-)
19:47:41 <ralsina_> teknico: OTOH it's totally post-hoc rationalization because we only figured out how to do that after we implemented it
19:47:58 <Aeyoun> teknico: setup your server to let extension-less files be treated as text/html
19:48:17 <Aeyoun> drop extension in the INDEX_FILE option. COULD work.
19:48:50 <teknico> Aeyoun, I don't mind showing to extension either, mind you
19:48:52 <Aeyoun> ralsina_: hey, I support markup language equality! :P
19:49:05 <teknico> I just object to the means used, I don't share the end :-)
19:49:30 <teknico> anyway
19:50:07 <Aeyoun> I track .htm=>.html redirects, see around 150 of them every day. https://www.aeyoun.com/how-to/redirect-htm-to.html
19:52:00 <ralsina_> Aeyoun: do you also fix upper/lower case URLs?
19:52:42 <Aeyoun> No, haven’t seen any indication that it’s a problem.
19:52:54 <teknico> ralsina_, aren't URLs case-sensitive (except for the domain part)?
19:53:02 <Aeyoun> Probably should, though.
19:53:11 <Aeyoun> teknico: yeah, but all my URLs are lowercase.
19:53:43 <teknico> yeah, uppercase in URLs is ugly
19:54:05 <teknico> it'd be nice not having to add metadata to each source file, either section or translations
19:54:45 <teknico> how about grouping the (source) translations of a post in a folder?
19:55:11 <teknico> and the filename for each language would be the output filename
19:55:47 <teknico> but we still don't have the translated folder, uhm
19:56:45 <Aeyoun> Matching input folder/file-naming with URLs is good approach, I think.
19:57:01 <Aeyoun> If you need to change a file, you always know exactly where the file is.
19:57:26 <teknico> true, but currently it's not like that
19:58:04 <teknico> source files are in default language folders and are named in default language, just adding the language code
19:58:17 <teknico> which is why we can link them together
19:59:46 <teknico> then we add the slug to translate the filename
20:00:03 <teknico> I tried added the section to translate the folder, but it's not there yet
20:00:08 <teknico> s/added/adding/
20:00:19 <teknico> (adding to metadata, that is)
20:00:56 <teknico> bah, i18n/L10n is hard
20:03:52 <s2hc_johan> Aeyoun: It was you and I that discussed sections in different languages, thing it worked a bit out of the box
20:04:12 <s2hc_johan> the problem would be with "also available in"
20:05:29 <s2hc_johan> haven't tested but if you put one post in posts/food/meet.rst and one in posts/mat/kott.rst, there would be no relation between the two posts right
20:12:36 <KwBot> [nikola] humitos opened issue #2114: .. template: directive is not used in translated pages (.en.rst) https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2114
20:12:48 <teknico> s2hc_johan, yeah, that was my concern
20:14:54 <KwBot> [nikola] humitos opened issue #2115: Use a different template for all the translated pages https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2115
20:16:26 <humitos> I just want to say: "Thanks you guys", again. I really love this project ;)
20:22:39 <Aeyoun> humitos: feel free to drop love notes in this channel every day, if you like.
20:24:08 <humitos> Aeyoun: ok, I will write a bot for that ;)
20:24:40 <KwBot> [nikola] teknico opened issue #2116: Complete URL translation https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2116
20:24:45 <Aeyoun> humitos: hey! only genuine human-to-chat-room love!
20:25:36 <teknico> Filed an issue, also referencing a previous issue (#1914)
20:26:57 <humitos> hehe!
20:33:50 <ralsina_> teknico: I don't really know how we would present that you request to users
20:34:07 <ralsina_> if we can find a reasonable not-insanely-complicated "UI" then awesome
20:34:14 <ralsina_> if not, we'll live without it :-(
20:36:14 <teknico> ralsina_, well, we could leave the source files as they are, so the mechanism to relate translation would also remain
20:36:45 <teknico> we already translate the filename by setting the slug in the metadata
20:36:50 <ralsina_> teknico: yes, but the output folder is currently decided based on location of the sources
20:37:29 <teknico> yeah, we could translate the section folder if there's a "section" entry in metadata
20:37:40 <ralsina_> so, either we go  set metadata that changes location of output" or "add metadata to relate translations that are in different folders"
20:37:57 <teknico> basically translating Post.folder in Post.destination_path
20:38:00 <ralsina_> and totally NOT BOTH :-)
20:38:22 <teknico> ralsina_, I would not do the second
20:38:46 <teknico> it seems easier to keep translations close to each other
20:39:00 <teknico> and possibly also named in the default language, as they are now
20:39:18 <teknico> but definitely not both indeed :-)
20:39:33 <ralsina_> Also, if you change the output folder, you have to consider it for links, they will break
20:39:50 <ralsina_> but maybe we already are smart enough fixing links
20:46:40 <teknico> yeah, it would seem so
20:47:20 <teknico> ok, I'll go to bed now and leave you to ponder the conundrum :-)
20:52:34 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- [nikola] ralsina created fix-2114 (+1 new commit): http://git.io/vnPHS
20:52:34 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- nikola/fix-2114 7e6e973 Roberto Alsina: Fix #2114
20:52:54 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- [nikola] ralsina opened pull request #2117: Fix #2114 (master...fix-2114) http://git.io/vnPHb
20:55:48 <Aeyoun> “Web design is now completely boring.” http://thenextweb.com/opinion/2015/09/23/zzzzzz/
20:58:36 -travis-ci:#nikola- getnikola/nikola#6470 (fix-2114 - 7e6e973 : Roberto Alsina): The build passed.
20:58:37 -travis-ci:#nikola- Change view: https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/commit/7e6e97355e28
20:58:37 -travis-ci:#nikola- Build details: https://travis-ci.org/getnikola/nikola/builds/81853931
20:59:25 <humitos> something changed in the v7.1.1 on the all-nocdn.css file and ".. tip:" is not rendered in a pretty way now: http://linkode.org/1n1ZwnhXJqQijmL4MsRcv3
20:59:50 <humitos> most of the options in the "div.tip" class were removed :(
21:03:55 <humitos>   /* stolen from Boostrap 3 (.panel .panel-default .panel-heading) */
21:05:12 <ralsina_> humitos: weird
21:05:19 <ralsina_> I wonder where that went
21:06:11 <ralsina_> humitos: proposed a branch for one of your issues, please test it, I have not even TRIED it
21:06:32 <humitos> ralsina_: ok
21:15:46 <humitos> ralsina_: ahí lo probé
21:15:52 <humitos> (y no me funcionó)
21:17:31 <ralsina_> humitos: ok, lo tendre que ver mas tarde entonces
21:17:44 <humitos> ralsina_: k
21:19:23 <ralsina_> humitos: ya es "mas tarde" :-)
21:19:34 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- [nikola] ralsina pushed 1 new commit to fix-2114: http://git.io/vnXe3
21:19:34 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- nikola/fix-2114 1e5f4a7 Roberto Alsina: set lang properly in generic_page_renderer
21:19:36 <humitos> hahaha
21:19:37 <ralsina_> pull y proba de nuevo, por lo menos aca falla con el error esperable 
21:22:29 <ralsina_> Ah, english in this channel!
21:29:22 <KwBot> [nikola] ralsina closed issue #2114: .. template: directive is not used in translated pages (.en.rst) https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/issues/2114
21:29:37 -GitHub[nikola]:#nikola- [nikola] ralsina deleted fix-2114 at 1e5f4a7: http://git.io/vnXUS
21:36:18 -travis-ci:#nikola- getnikola/nikola#6474 (master - 7d3a7f2 : Roberto Alsina): The build passed.
21:36:19 -travis-ci:#nikola- Change view: https://github.com/getnikola/nikola/compare/9d5093cc836a...7d3a7f216b91
21:36:19 -travis-ci:#nikola- Build details: https://travis-ci.org/getnikola/nikola/builds/81860403